Ideal RPG?
 

Sudden though, having nothing at all to do with the fact that I haven't had much interest in any particular game for a while and those that I have been interested in have already been discussed at length and I may or may not be running out of stuff to say, I'm curious so see what people like to see in RPG games and what elements make good games for us.

I'm definately an Elder Scrolls fan -and by nature don't much like being bossed around ;)- so I love the open ended design of the games.

Although, I'm still pretty sure that being inclined go my own way or not, Navi and her "Hey! Go this way!" would still have driven me up the wall in Ocarina of Time.

I have to admit too, that I'm also a big fan of stuff. I like stuff. Swords to play with, magic items, inventory fillers, clothes, and various other sort of miscellaney that may or may not have much bearing on the actual game. I want my purple stone non-magical ring, thank you very much.

For me, it's kind of a two-part question, those being actual Role Playing and then what it enjoy in terms of game mechanics.

For the first, I do really enjoy the Elder Scrolls for that exact aspect, that feeling of living in the secondary world. The more options, the better. I like being able to customize everything and do pretty much whatever I want. Restrictions on things tend to lessen the experience for me.

On the other hand, when it comes to gameplay I enjoy, I really like turn-based battle systems or grid-based strategy RPGs. I also like games with in-depth combo attacks. I like item synthesis, hunting for rare items, equipment upgrading and customizing...

In addition to that, I like character customization, too, with a class system and stat-allocation, skill trees or something similar. I like to tinker, basically.

Overall, though, probably the most important thing to me is a feeling of reward. I like games where if I play for a half-hour/hour I feel like I got something accomplished.

I find I get conflicted when it comes to shifting classes and whatnot, like the FFTactics games tend to do. I get annoyed if skills don't go up fast enough, even though it's nice when I get there. I don't much like the limitation the class system poses when it comes to using certain abilities, though the primary and secondary skills options off-sets some of that. I like to be able to work on any akill or ability that I want to, to improve it. Elder Scrolls games are like that but it was also part of the old Quest of Fire games, similar to King's Quest.

I loved the old King's Quest, Quest of Fire (I think. Not totally sure of the title) games for some of the problem solving aspects, but also got very annoyed with them for the same reasons. Problem sovling is fun when you can figure it out but getting stumped on something can really suck the fun out of a game really fast, especially when there are no other options but to confront the puzzle.

I guess as far as game play goes, I'm a bigger fan of interactable game play where one can directly click and inspect things, pick things up, etc. Bioware had games like that but they were limited as far as environmental interaction went. At least the ones I played. I don't if I care much about turn-based versus real time, so long as whatever system is used is good.

Well, if I knew how to script, you could see what my ideal RPG would play like. :p

Final Fantasy Tactics was pretty good with its class system, but it was also unbalanced. DnD is probably my favorite system for that, honestly, given how customizable it is.

I am really partial to turn-based over real time. I prefer to rely on strategy rather than reflexes. I prefer agility-based individual turns, though, rather than "one side goes, then the other side goes".

Puzzles, I don't have much patience for, unless they're really well designed and actually fun to try and figure out. Add random encounters to the mix, and outright hate them.

What does get to me is when the two are mixed. That's how it is in Baldur's Gate, where characters move when their turn comes around, so some act faster than others, but they only act according to what you last told them to do. It let to lots and lots of pausing mid-battle to give out more various instructions, and then watching the various characters and judging when to pause again to relay new instructions. I usually ended up watching my mages for when they cast spells so I knew when to tell them to cast a new spell, and keeping an eye out for my ranged characters in case they ran out of arrows and ran up to the bad guys to attack with whatever backup they had. Could get a bit tricky, hence I liked to keep around a lot of beatsticks to make things easier. Fewer people to watch out for.

Yeah, I didn't think that that was really the best implementation of the rules, though I'm pretty sure Neverwinter Nights is the same way.

Of course, you bring up another interesting point, that being the balance between mages and fighter types. It seems like most games can't get it quite right.

I wouldn't say I found balance to be an issue. I saw them more as different tools, to be blunt about it, that varied in usefullness depending on the situations. In BG I've never found myself wishing I had fewer of one type over the other, most of the time. I usually wanted 2 fighters, 2 mages, at least, and the other two were grab bag.

Never played a character in Morrowind that was only one way or the other so I couldn't say about that either. I suppose I could try that and see what happens. I like having acess to a mix of skills.

Well, I was thinking more Neverwinter Nights, but even there, it isn't as bad as tabletop. The thing about playing casters in real-time is that it's a lot harder to be a super-genius paranoid Batman than it is on paper. You can have all your feats and spells set up to perfection, but when a Frost Giant comes charging across the screen at you, it doesn't much matter.

I was also thinking more in terms of JRPGS, too. In a lot of those, it's the opposite, and mages get the short end of the stick. In most of Idea Factory's games, fighters end up being able to do 100+ hit combos by the end of the game, while mages are stuck with one or two-hit spells that hit a huge AoE for almost no damage, comparatively.

It's hard for me to pin down aspects of what I think of as a "favorite game" since I'm all over the place. I've found that the games with some of the best options in terms of gameplay usually don't have the same kind of freedom that would be nice, as well as the opposite. For instance, I really liked Grandia's battle system because it had a lot of strategy involved, but it was pretty linear gameplay. It DID however have somewhat customizable skills, in that the more you used a particular weapon or magic, the more skills you could use with them. Of course not every character could use every weapon either.

Never played Neverwinter Nights I'm afraid, but it sounds something to the Elder Scrolls issue of using spells in an active fight. Unless you're running backwards at high speed, casting anything offensive is likely to be a problem, especially if you attempt more than one shot.

Umm, what's "JRPG"?

JRPG: Japanese Role Playing Game, which is usually used for the type of game Final Fantasy or Dragon Quest is. In general that kind of game is less lenient in terms of freedom for the sake of the story.

I remember Neverwinter Nights myself, though I never really got into it fully because of the real-time aspect. It wasn't terrible, but like Suzerain said, real time is fairly detrimental to casting types at times.

The other thing about NWN is that you're controlling four characters in what's basically 3.5 D&D in real-time, making it kind of hectic. It's hard to keep track of all your feats and class abilities and spells in a 6-second round.

And, yes, JRPGs are... RPGs that come from Japan, usually being fairly anime-inspired. I'm kind of surprised you're unfamiliar with them, Quiet. I tend to like them more, most of the time, than western RPGs, but that's likely because I grew up with them. (Literally. When I was six, my uncle came over and gave me a SNES and Final Fantasy 3 (6), then continued to supply me with a steady stream of RPGs as time went on.)

I'm a character freak then a story freak, when it comes to rpgs. The first that draws me in is always a character personalty [if they have one] and the idea of being able to change clothes and outfits. Though if they don't have the ability to change clothes and yadda yadda I normally still will get it if I like the characters in the game.

Then comes the story. Everything else in the game could suck [Minus the character part.] if the story is grand and the gameplay is at least understandable then I'll most likely play it just to know what happens. Though I notice a lot of time they will have an awesome storyline until about half way when I realize what is happening and then I just get annoyed cause I know the ending. I also like Rpgs that have an ending xD I don't know why I just do. I get bored with games like Elder Scrolls cause it gives me too much freedom and then I lose sight of what I'm actually suppose to be doing xD

Though if they don't have an awesome storyline but awesome gameplay I often will pick it up and play it anyways. I like turn base or time based[?] I think that's what it is called. xD I'm not a fan of first person. I hate it ._.; I like seeing what is around me. I also like having party members that I control or have a really good AI.

Um, I think that is it really ._.; Music isn't a big deal to me and voice acting is part of the character stuff to me.

Though part of me feels depressed cause I don't know many new rpgs that don't seem like things I've played before.

Story issues like the one in Star Ocean: Till the end of Time, or whatever it was called? 'You've just fought through massive battles, beating tonnes of enemies, fighting your way to a magic portal to save your world when lo! Your world doesn't actually exist! You and it are merely a televisio show for the amusement of this other world that the portal takes you to. Dun Dun Dun!' My friend almost broke the disc.

Ah. Makes sense now. I know about the Japanese Rpgs, have friends that play them a lot (FF, Wild Arms, Suikoden, etc). I've just never seen JRPG used as an abbreviation before.

Part of me actually liked that the ending in Star Ocean: Til the End of Time. Though It didn't make any sense at all xD I hate it more when you know what is going to happen. Like, the main's character best friend turning evil.

I do miss though when games would make you think your main villain was one person then changing it half way through. Maybe I haven't played enough recent rpgs though to know for a fact if they don't do this anymore...My most recent rpg was Folklore for ps3 xD

I'd hardly finished any. I'm not usually in any hurry. I don't actually know how Star Ocean ended since we got so pissed off at the 'revelation' we quit. I found the villains behind FFIX to be interesting though, Kuja in particular. Can't remember how that ended specifically, it was a while ago, but I remember his part. (We're reasonably certain that Kuja's a 'he'.)

I'm pretty sure Kuja is a He too xD

I never actually got far in FFIX. I only remember the black mage town and that's about it xD

I really love FFX-2. >_> Mainly cause of the outfits xD
Actually that's the only reason. I love the outfits and mastering jobs x.x

I like the music in the black mage village, and the story behind the black mages was interesting. Vivi was cool. :)

One of the things I had silly amounts of fun with were the chocobo things. Getting your chocobo, the chocobo king, and exploring and flying aroud. I spent a good portion of the game just playing around with that, or doing the mini games. If I don't a lot of freedom as far as story or missions go, I do like having mini-games and other things to occupy my attention when I don't feel like progressing with the story.

I have a hard time with that.
Elder scroll = Too much freedom and forget what I'm doing in the first place.

Plus I'm the type of person I'll try to rush through the game to know how the story goes if it's really good. So by the time I get to the final boss I can't take it on. xD

Then I redo it and that's when I do all the side stuff xD

Ah. Yeah, I have forgotten at times what I was precisely doing in Morrowind, but that's where the auto-journal comes in handy. It keeps track of what I'm to so a little back reading and I'm where I need to be again. :).

Lol
Well [Like in mmos] I tend to forget to read >_> And I just click on 'accept' xD
God, now I wanna play games >.<
Darn you computer! Fix yourself!

I keep thinking about my consols over in the corner that I haven't touched in ages. I've been looking for a new RPG to play for PS2 or Wii, but I haven't encountered yet that really catch my interest. I'm not so keen on the battle system in FFXII. Have a couple others to try though.

Dark Cloud 2. Do it now! :D

@Suzerain
I've always wanted to play Dark Cloud 2 ._.;
I always forget about it though xD

@Quiet
I would say .Hack but that's sort of like FFXII
I really wanna play FFXIV >_>; Buuuuut that needs either a working computer or internet on a ps3 xD Both of which I don't have.

I think in all of my games I've either beat the game or at the final boss and don't plan to beat it. [I tend to stop right before the final bosses...I don't know why x.x]

I thought .Hack was really good, up until the last game, where hunting for virus cores became an hours-long waste of time just to advance the story. One of the worst ideas I've ever seen in a game.

And, FF14 is out already? God, I remember the first time I play FF1...

Hm? GU or just .hack//
I actually don't like GU cause the first .hack took so long to beat the bosses. I seriously think I spent hours getting to and fighting those bosses x.x

Well depends what you think FFXIV is >_>; I guess some people are calling the second FFXIII, 14 too. But yeah it's been out for a while now. I believe it actually came out before 13 was released.

I don't know if they count as RPGs but I'm at boss fights in both Devil May Cry and Castlevania, but as I've ignored both for so long I really really suck and can no longer beat said bosses. I'm actually at (what I think) is the end boss for Castlevania: Lament of Innocence. Oops.

I like the Castlevania games I've seen so far, though I think they qualify more as adventure games. I have a buch of items but don't use them a whole lot, and the differnt armour and such are levelled so there's no really purpose in using any of the older ones once you get the good stuff.

Castlevania doesn't seem to have much of a story behind it besides the old steadfast "have whip, will travel" style, but it does cover it's lack of original story fairly well. :). I like the in game explanation for the presense of a magic and item shop right next to forboding, evil, haunted castle. The owner of the castle simply lets him has his shop there to give the adventurers who try to kill the master something of a sporting chance.

I like Renaldo's comments, "It would seem that eternal life is extremely boring." *commence with justification speech for shop and random items strewn about the castle.*

I only played the regular .Hack games. The bosses were pretty brutal in those, too, especially Kubia.

And, oh, okay, I wasn't aware they were being numbered like that.

I love the Castlevania and DMC. I think of them as RPG but I pretty much think anything other then FPS and Sports [and a few other games that I don't know where you would put them.] as Rpgs x.x;;

I'm weird.

Anyways, should get the newest Castlevania. I enjoy their story pretty much. Sometimes them wrapping other older games with it. I've only beat two though...the ps1 one and the DS one ._.;

@Suzerain
.Hack Topic:
Yesh they were x.x I hated it cause once I was at the final bossed in one of the volumes and I had to leave to go somewhere. I was like "Nuuuu!" Cause I spent so long getting there and fighting the stupid thing.

Final Fantasy Topic:
Yeah it's weird.
FF14 is an MMO [Replacing FF11 pretty much.]
As FF13 is the same old style of game as they normally have. Plus they announced a squeal as they were announcing FF13. [I think it's called FF13 Verses or something.] Which is coming out soon. But I guess fans are just calling it FF14 which makes me upset cause it messes up the counting >_> If anything it should be called FF15

I have Order of Ecclesia but I can't get past angry crab boy. He keeps killing me. :(.

I saw the new Castlevania in the game store the other day but I don't have a PS3 and don't intend to get one. I might have a look at Curse of Darkness which my friend is fond of.

Haven't finished Devil May Cry yet either. I'm on Nelo Angelo round two, and he irritates me.

Aw why no ps3?

And yeah...I don't remember names so I have no clue where you are xD

@.Hack: Right, I forgot how you couldn't save in dungeons, either. Doubly frustrating. Awesome concept for those games, but poorly executed.

@FF: I honestly lost interest after 10. The games have just gone away from what I enjoyed about the older ones. I'm still praying for a sequel to Tactics, but I guess in a way, the Tactics Ogre remake was sort of like that.

Order of Ecclesia is one of the DS ones, the one with the more standard Castlevania artwork on the front. Dawn of Sorrows looks more cartoony. I'm stuck on the first boss that appears in this tower, gradually crawls his way up and shoots bubbles at you. He sucks!

No PS3. I'm cheap and very new-tech resistant. The last system I bought was my DS a few years ago, the PS2 before that when it wa slim, ane the wii was a birthday gift. I don't have plans to buy anymore consoles for a while unless there's a game I have to have. DMC was the reason I bought the PS2.

If anything, I'd highly recommend the PSP. It's portable, has better graphics than the DS, and there are some fantastic RPGs on it you're missing out on. It's probably my favorite, system, actually.

Yeah I regret getting a DS instead of a psp -.-;; I got it for pokemon black&White but once I learned that they took out my favorite part of it I didn't even bother getting the game.

@.hack: GU fixed that a bit. The dungeons aren't as long and the boss fights are rather easy in my mind. They don't nearly take as long to fight bosses but you aren't...you? Your like a summon or something xD

@FF: Yeah after about FF12 I stopped caring. 13 looks stupid...and from what I heard not something I would enjoy. 14 I want cause I want to see what they did with the classes. And I love mmos xD [White mage ftw! >o<]

I do wish they would make another tactics like the ps1 one. The GBA/DS one is alright. I enjoyed it but that was only cause I didn't play the first tactics until after xD

I'm tossing FFXII. I'll see if I can dig up anything mentioned here for a trade in. Not sure if I'll be hanging onto Demonstone either. I know the setting it comes from but the realistic sort of game play annoyed me. Same reason as with LOTR: Two Towers that I've hardly played. Might give it another shot.

Demonstone was an embarrassment to Drizzt. He's actually the worst of the four playable characters in the game. Not a very good game, overall, in my opinion, either.

Didn't know he was playable. There are three characters to begin with already. Is he a secret guy or something? Someone you get for finishing the game? (And given his realms fancyness he should be.)

Nope. You have to defend Mithral Hall halfway through the game and it makes you play as him. It's really a shame, since I bought the game just for that opportunity. :p

Ah. I was just curious. I thought he was a cameo.

Dont want to get a PSP. Costs more money! Well, maybe not with the new handheld thing comeing out. I'll harass my brother, try his first. ;)